He is a mere variation on Palpatine set in place so that we can see how Kylo Ren’s opposite choice to Darth Vader plays out. Anakin Skywalker: Something’s happening. It’s in losing the mentor that the young hero needs to learn that they can figure things out on their own without their mentor. One of the profound things about all this for me is that the film is the film demonstrates from within itself how traditions need to grow rather than ossify and how they must be open to revision rather than dogmatic. Anakin Skywalker: We lost something. INTO JAPANESE. What if Obi-Wan and Yoda had been more introspective with Luke? It’s not inconceivable they don’t follow each other’s rules. Anakin Skywalker: This is … ―Obi-Wan Kenobi and Darth Vader — Listen But I thought- YOU DID WHAT? Kylo’s rise in Darkness seems to have led to Rey’s rise as his Light counterpart. Yoda came back, like Nietzsche’s Zarathustra, to reject the old dogma that he was so responsible for promulgating in the first place. I am also bewildered that people are angry that we didn’t learn Snoke’s origin–as though that supposed mystery was important. Why anyone centered their expectations of this story on the idea that it would turn on Snoke’s origins or Rey’s parents’ reveal is beyond me. I see the next logical step, in Episode IX, to be Rey and Kylo Ren figuring out that the true balance of the Force is a matter of figuring out how to be constructive with both the Light and the Dark in human nature rather than trying to snuff the one or the other out in the name of Order, in the process giving rise to Evil. With Luke gone, except perhaps as a force ghost, and Snoke gone, in Episode IX the path is clear for Kylo Ren and Rey to supersede their mentors and figure out their own story. They’re not detective movies for fans to unpuzzle. Padmé: They trust you with their lives. Count Dooku: I sense great fear in you, Skywalker. I should have known the Jedi were plotting to take over. Instead of moving on from those movies into Episodes IV-VI this works on some level like an alternative storyline that, in VII, picks up after III. He had gone so far as to chop off Vader’s hand before he got a hold of himself after the Emperor gleefully cackled, praised him, and encouraged him to finish the job. I was going to see if Rian Johnson could rationalize Luke’s situation satisfyingly. Dad, whats the point of praying if God already has a divine plan? Thus do all believers: that is why all belief is worth so little. On the rewatch of the film I loved the poetry of the image. It was the way to make this story profoundly derivative. A lot is made of how religious Star Wars is. 97% Upvoted. The myth of the super hero film, of the hero’s journey—perhaps even of Nietzsche’s Zarathustra’s Ubermensch?—is that we just need a god or a superhuman to come along and fix our problems for us. He’s trash talking. In his book Thus Spoke Zarathustra, Nietzsche appropriates Zarathustra, the great historical founder of the transformative Persian religion Zoroastrianism, to explore his own philosophy. The theme of leaders training and giving way to their successors was also prominent in Leia’s journey. Kylo Ren is taking an inverse journey on the Dark Side to the one Luke took on the Light Side. I was so happy to learn that Yoda finally got it too. Archived. 01:53:41 I have failed you. It would be like Zoroastrians rewriting Zoroastrianism or Christians telling a new story where Jesus himself fails in order to signal to Christians that their tradition is not perfect and can’t be relied on to be so but must be ever renewed with new and better ideas. Obi-Wan: Well, then you are lost! It’s not some betrayal of Star Wars traditions to leave it opaque. I think she could have done better than (and eventually does better than) slap Poe Dameron across the face but I liked the way that the film explored her relationship with him in general. It was definitely a contrived enough conceit that I had to process what I thought of it cognitively and decide if I could buy it or not. Now Luke can play the Obi-Wan and Yoda role and correct their mistakes instead of repeating them. Luke had great powers in the end, but they were the powers to project himself as larger than life and to thereby inspire us, not the powers to be larger than life. Sort by. In his galaxy—and, fatefully, in his own mind—Luke got built up as big as he is in our minds. Wow, Luke is even more powerful than we have ever seen a Jedi be! We know how Anakin actually went as Vader. 419. View discussions in 1 other community. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. captivating quotations from movies, television, literature and people - curated by actual geeks. Obi-Wan: Not to worry. I should have known the Jedi were plotting to take over! 3 years ago. 136 comments. Anakin Skywalker: No, I promise you. In Return of the Jedi he movingly refused to accept Yoda’s absolutist judgment that Vader was simply evil and there was nothing to do but kill him. It was part of an overdue return to Star Wars quality imaginativeness that was present at various points in the film. if i get 600 votes I get a pug! And that’s why he failed. Midi-chlorian count higher than Master Yoda. Finally, Luke’s return at the end of the movie was truly wonderful. Dad, Lizzy's teasing me! You say you believe in Zarathustra? Dad, boys are in the back yard!!! Obi-Wan: Well, then you are lost. The whole scene is also a beautiful moment of growth for Luke that pays off Empire Strikes Back where Yoda insists that Luke’s problem is that he is never able to concentrate on the present and keep his mind on what he is doing but is always looking off to the horizon (something Yoda has reminded us about earlier in the movie). Explore the world's faith through different perspectives on religion and spirituality! What? Anakin Skywalker: From my point of view, the Jedi are evil! 5 months ago. His power is to project an idea to us with every ounce of intense human effort he has. A way of describing cultural information being shared. I wasn’t crazy with the corner that Abrams and Kasdan had written Johnson into, but given the mess he was handed he made something coherent and satisfying and that did justice to Luke, where Abrams had irritatingly left him looking like a coward for no good reason. Anakin Skywalker: From my point of view, the Jedi are evil! (3) Even if they did identify as Rule-Following Sith–the Emperor and Vader are dead and it’s been thirty years. As a child I literally had my first impactful exposure to the concept of pacifistic, self-sacrificial, redemptive love from Luke Skywalker. It’s malleable. And Kylo Ren’s fear of him indicated he was afraid to find out. "I should have known the Jedi were plotting to take over!" We already know his character type. For him to fail in this way was to undermine the character’s defining strength. - "/tv/ - Television & Film" is 4chan's imageboard dedicated to the discussion of television and film. He’s grown as powerful as we could possibly fantasize. We should have known. We can’t be Luke Skywalker. After a while he gives this speech sending them away, which was on my mind throughout Rian Johnson’s The Last Jedi: Alone I go now, my disciples! Then we learn Kylo Ren’s side of the story wherein he’s confronted by an aggressive Luke Skywalker uncomplicatedly trying to murder him. (We all do.) Now we’re resetting the table and exploring what would have happened if Anakin had gone differently–a Kylo Ren route wise enough to overthrow his malignant overlord but stay on the Dark Side. Scared... OFF TO BEL AIR! At that moment he had gotten a hold of himself and done the brave and pacifistic and self-sacrificial and redemptive thing. I like thinking that she’s so in the Force in that moment, in a quiet and invisible way that we only get to realize was there because of how the scene ends where her use of the Force has to suddenly be visible to save her life. What made me happy about it was that she finally did something real with her Force powers. Luke’s tragic moment of weakness and evil, with all its horrible consequences, was about this fundamental truth. But just a moment before he had failed. But just as it was a mistake for Luke, and us, to interpret him as only his moment of throwing away his light saber and taking the Emperor’s lightning, it is wrong to define him only as his moment of raising his light saber.

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